Transmission Leaking in my '89 312-8 (21-12K806)

[DISISIT13 1]

Ok so this is my first venture into transmissions in general. I am fairly new to the maintenance side of the wheel horse as well. My '89 312-8 has been in the family for a decade and a half, and I've just gained full ownership and honestly am tickled pink. 

 

I noticed that the inside of my left rear tire has been wet with fluid the last two times that I've mowed the grass. I drained the old fluid from the plug (1/4" allen key) right by the hitch, and refilled it with SAE 90 GL5. It then became extremely apparent where my leak was coming from. 

 

 

I know that there are at least two seals that need replaced, and I am definitely replacing the shift boot while I am at it, but I'm having trouble identifying which seals exactly I need to order because there are several different numbers listed (100863, 114677, 100443, or 6449). 

 

http://www.toro.com/en-us/parts/Pages/PartsDetails.aspx?mybeid=1706&serialNumber=None&modelNumber=21-12K806&searchTerm=9lzIRv+p5zedZ5sKqyyATtyjaDG176I4PGPf6fmEm91hsAXYhs36Km5LhfWUjtL7KmlQpvDuEmQ=&defaultTab=parts#toro-parts-lookup-tabs. (Mechanical Transmission, 8-Speed Page)

 

After acquiring the right parts, I need some guidance in replacing them, I haven't the slightest idea how this thing comes apart. Does anyone have any tips or guidance for me before I start taking this thing apart?

 

Thank you for your time.

 

-Donnie

[Desko 552]

First did you only put 2 qts in and does it have 1 inch axles or 1 1/8 axles if it has 1 1/8 axles the numbers are 100443

[DISISIT13 1]

I only used two quarts. It wasn't until the second quart was added that I noticed the "class 3 leak." Is there a way to tell the axle diameter without a measuring tape? I'll have to check when I get to the house if it requires measurement.

[Desko 552]

Not that I'm aware of

Edited September 27, 2014 by Desko

[stevasaurus 22,229]

You do not have to open the transmission to change any of the seals.  You need to measure the axles...you can do that with a tape measure on the outside of the hub where the axle is flush.

 

1" axles take Wheel Horse part # 100863...or SKF #9815 at your favorite NAPA dealer.

 

1 1/8" axles take WH # 100443 or SKF #11050.

 

You can pick the 1/8" thick old seal out with an awl...do a search...plenty of threads that tell ways to do this.  Hope that helps. 

[doc724 924]

If it is leaking that badly, you may have more than just a seal problem.  Jack up that side and see if the wheel/axle will move up and down or front to back.  Any movement at all means the needle bearing is gone.  In and out movement (about 1/8 inch max) is normal.  Hopefully it is just a seal and the repair (after you get the hub off) is easy.  Check the forum to see tricks others have used to get the seal on without damage.

[squonk 38,815]

Get it jacked up and take out the hub set screw and start spraying with penetrant. It might not help get the hub off but it can't hurt.

[Ed Kennell 35,490]

" Is there a way to tell the axle diameter without a measuring tape?      :eusa-think:  

1.  1-2" micrometer

2.  0-6" dial or digital caliper

3.  Use an adjustable      and adjust it to fit the axle.  Then compare the      opening to a US quarter .  A well used quarter measures 0.953".

 

                                                                         

[DISISIT13 1]

Thank you all for the help. I was out today, haven't had a whole lot of time to get after it, but I just got the wheels off. 

 

There is a little play from the left axle (front and back, up and down) maybe an 1/8" or less.

Left Axle

 

Right axle seems a lot more stationary. Would that be maybe because the seal has slid out from the left side?

Right Axle

Sorry it's sideways

 

Maybe I should just go ahead and replace the needle bearing while I'm at it and parts are available?

 

I'm about to work on getting the hubs off to measure the axle diameter to find out what seals to buy. I'll keep you all posted on progress.

 

 

[Ed Kennell 35,490]

I/8" radial movement  means the bearing needs replaced.  A new seal will still leak.  With that much movement, the axle may already be damaged in the seal area if the worn bearing was allowing the axle to rub on the steel part of the seal.

Edited September 28, 2014 by ekennell

[Ed Kennell 35,490]

Take Mikes advice  above and get some PB blaster in the set screw holes.

 

Buy or make a good puller that pushes against the end of the axle to pull the hubs.   Do not hammer on the hubs.

[pfrederi 17,114]

The up down, front back movement of the axle is a show stopper.  You will have to split the transmission  to replace the needle bearing.  Above all with that much free play stop using the machine!!!! The needle bearing may have failed completely and the needles can damage other part in the tranny.  This is C81 that the PO used with out noticing teh rear axlle getting play in it.  The needles destroyed the hard to find 1533 ball bearing

[DISISIT13 1]

So I got the hubs off with a three jaw puller and some much recommended PB blaster. I'm working on ordering parts; seals, shifter boot, and needle bearings. If i'm tearing the tranny off, should I replace anything else while I'm in there?

 

[DISISIT13 1]

Also, it turns out the Axles are 1"

[DISISIT13 1]

So now that I know that the seal I need is 100863, but when I went to order the needle bearing, there are two again.

 

How do you know which one you need? 9416 or 1528?

[Lagersolut 613]

So now that I know that the seal I need is 100863, but when I went to order the needle bearing, there are two again.

 

How do you know which one you need? 9416 or 1528?

 

 This should be your parts list

 

http://www.edslawn.com/oemparts?aribrand=RED#/Toro_Consumer/21-12K806%2c_312-8_Garden_Tractor%2c_1989/MECHANICAL_TRANSMISSION_8-SPEED/21-12K806-1706-1989/810607R1-07R10006-0002

 

# 11 1528 is the axle needle bearing - there's a nice cross ref chart pinned to this topic at the top of the threads - you can save a ton of money getting quality after market stuff from Napa -Motion - E-bay or even Amazon .

 

If it were me,  I'd get the trans open to see whats going on before ordering parts, you're not going to know for sure what all your going to need/find  until it's opened up

[Ed Kennell 35,490]

Ditto on Lagers advice, also before you open the tranny, please watch the videos on tranny rebuilding by member  STEVASAURUS.   

[pfrederi 17,114]

 

 This should be your parts list

 

http://www.edslawn.com/oemparts?aribrand=RED#/Toro_Consumer/21-12K806%2c_312-8_Garden_Tractor%2c_1989/MECHANICAL_TRANSMISSION_8-SPEED/21-12K806-1706-1989/810607R1-07R10006-0002

 

# 11 1528 is the axle needle bearing - there's a nice cross ref chart pinned to this topic at the top of the threads - you can save a ton of money getting quality after market stuff from Napa -Motion - E-bay or even Amazon .

 

If it were me,  I'd get the trans open to see whats going on before ordering parts, you're not going to know for sure what all your going to need/find  until it's opened up

What he said!!

 

The 1" Axle needle bearing WH 1528 is a B-1616 and is less than $6 at bearing places.

[stevasaurus 22,229]

I would replace the other seals also while you got it open.    Take and post pictures.

[Don1977 604]

Be sure to oil the out side of the new roller bearing before you drive it in, it will make the insulation go a lot easier.  I changed to roller bearings and seals on my 312 a couple of month ago.

 

[DISISIT13 1]

Ok so I'm a week into my venture to replace the needle bearing. I have the transmission split, and my new ball bearing just made it in. I'm having trouble removing the old ball bearing from the transfer case. What tool/method is recommended for pulling this thing out? No worries, I'm taking lots of pictures and will post them.

 

 

[stevasaurus 22,229]

Those bearings are a pain for sure.  I have an air gun with a straight chisel bit...it popped it right out...could be I was lucky.  We have some threads on Red Square that show a bearing puller you can buy for this operation.  It goes down in the bearing and expands under the rim of the bearing with a slide weight.  Search 1533 bearing in transmissions section. 

[randhad 8]

I think you mean "needle bearings"? I used a socket that was roughly the same OD as the outer needle bearing - and drove it from inside/out.

 

Just to be sure, the ball bearings are fine - correct?

Edited January 29, 2015 by randhad

[DISISIT13 1]

No, the needle bearings were a pain, but I got them out pretty easily. I'll have to go borrow a slide hammer and bearing puller from AutoZone to get that ball bearing out. It's in decent shape but some of the retention band looks a little rough.  

[randhad 8]

Thanks for clarifying. I have the 1533 ball bearings and although they didn't look pretty, they spun nicely. So I didn't mess with them.

 

Out of curiosity, has anyone ever been successful in rebuilding the 1533 bearings? Or is that not an option?