Clutch HELP Work Horse 700

[northguy 10]

I want to use this tractor to pull an aerator and dump cart. Did not want to wear out or brake the stock motor so I put this new one in and kept and put away the oldie but goodie stock motor if I want to make it stock again. But now I have a problem. The motor works great but when you try to put it into gear (any gear) she will not go. Just starts to grind. The brake works, but it seems like no clutch. It worked before the motor switch. I did have to put a smaller belt on it. Still seems to be a lot of play. In fact I can pull the belt off the motor pulley pretty easy when brake is pushed down.

Any ideas? Not really sure how the clutch works on this. Can someone give me the simple explanation? Is the belt to big?

Thanks, really want to drive her around.

[Molon_Labe 731]

That's a great looking but let me ask: Did it have a belt guard before you changed the engine?

[KC9KAS 4,741]

You need the belt guard on the machine to get the belt to STOP so you can shift.

[slammer302 2,154]

You need a belt guard on it helps slow down the belt when you push the clutch in witch slows the transmission down so you can put in gear and watch out were ur muffler is blowing out it could burn the paint off that great hood there is a good chance you are going to do more damage to the mower with a aftermarket motor than the original I would put it back on and use it that's what they are made for thats just my two cents I done the same motor swap on a commando 6

[redsquarebob 27]

i had a similar problem on my 702 i tried to put it into gear and it grinded. the belt kept moving even with the clutch depressed. i bought a new belt and the problem was solved.the belt i took off seemed to be a little smaller than the new one. hopefully this helps!

[northguy 10]

It did have a belt guard and i had to change it a bit to get it to fit with the new motor. I put it back on when I tried the tractor and it would not let me **** into gear with the guard on.

So the belt is supose to stop moving when the brake /clutch is pushed which stops the trans from turning? And the pulley on the motor just spins?.

[northguy 10]

I should mention that I put a new but smaller belt on it. So what i am getting from the response is that i have to get the belt to stop so it can be shifted into gear. Not sure what I did wrong yet, will have to look at it again. and try to see why it is not stoppimg.  I just took the pully guard off so the belt could be seen in the photo.

[kudzu3 323]

My friend learned that the belt guard was necessary, also if the belt is rubber, there is too much friction to allow it to work, you may need a wheel horse belt.

[Racinbob 10,269]

That's correct northguy. If the belt continues to move the transmission input pulley will be spinning thus causing the grinding....and the potential for problems inside the transmission. The belt guard, when properly installed, 'guides' the belt so when you depress the clutch the motor pulley spins free of it.

Edited September 15, 2014 by Racinbob

[gwest_ca-(File Mod) 10,488]

Put the belt guard back on and see how far the belt is from the bottom flange of the guard with the belt tight. It should be about 1/8" from the bottom flange the full length of the guard. When you push the pedal down the slack in the belt is supported by that lower flange or lip. This allows the remaining slack to go to the engine pulley so it can slip. Some guards also have extensions or tabs at the engine pulley end that can be bent so they just clear a tight belt. They are close to the center line of the pulley top and bottom and also support the belt when slack.

 

As kudzu3 stated the belt must be completely covered with fabric - no raw rubber sides.

 

Garry

[Molon_Labe 731]

If you don't support the slack in the belt when the clutch is depressed gravity takes over and the belt continues to drive the transmission. The belt guard supports the belt when the clutch is depressed, disengaging drive to the transmission. I know, clear as mud.

[northguy 10]

Thanks for all the tips. I put the cover back on and still cant get it to slow the belt down. I went down 2 inches on the belt size cause the stock belt was too big. Not sure how I am going to solve this problem. The cover is not as close to the guard as it should be cause of the differance in the new motor. It sits higher in the frame then the stock motor. I guess a smaller belt would be worse cause it would be to tight. Anyone done a motor change that had this trouble of not being able to **** into gear? I am thinking now that I may have to fab a new belt cover. Not looking forward to that. Any more ideas?

 

Thanks guys.

[slammer302 2,154]

When I did the same motor swap I used the factory belt I mounted the belt and belt guard to the motor and made sure it was all lined up then I marked the holes in the mounting plate that way I new the belt and belt gaurd would all fit like it supposed to

[northguy 10]

I made the motor mounts and used existing holes in the frame. It does sit a bit higher then the stock motor. And I had to change to a smaller belt. Any idea of how I can make it work? I am thinking that I may need to make a new belt cover..

[slammer302 2,154]

Do you make sure it's idled all the way down when you first try to put it in gear it helps a lot

And don't baby it into gear do it firmly and I always go to first gear then go to what ever gear is needed

[northguy 10]

Will try it again and see if I can get it to idle down more. But the idea is that the belt guard holds the belt up and stops the belt from turning, slowing down or stopping the trans pulley from turning?

May have to work on the cover more too. I thought getting the motor to fit would be the hard part............. boy was I wrong. Really want to drive this tractor. Thanks everyone for your help. Will post my progress. Stay tuned.

[Ed Kennell 35,620]

I would try installing a tapered piece of wood inside the bottom flange of the belt guard to restore the proper support for the slack belt when shifting.  It can be fastened with  a couple wood screws thru the bottom flange where they will not be seen and easily be removed when you replace the oe engine. 

Edited September 17, 2014 by ekennell

[Molon_Labe 731]

One more suggestion. If your 700 has a belt retainer bracket on the idler pulley rotate it clockwise until it clears he belt by about 1/4". The bracket serves to pinch the belt when the clutch is depressed.

 

[northguy 10]

Two more great ideas. it does have that retainer piece. Will try both of them. Thanks again to everyone who has responded. This is a great place.

[Molon_Labe 731]

Two more great ideas. it does have that retainer piece. Will try both of them. Thanks again to everyone who has responded. This is a great place.

Let us know what you find. Just don't give up!!!

[stevasaurus 22,229]

To explain what happens here...the belt guard has some tabs welded or fastened on the inside...when you depress the clutch pedal, the tension pulley puts slack in the belt...this slack is funneled toward the engine pulley enabling the engine pulley to turn freely while the belt stops rotating...this means the the input pulley on the transmission stops turning and you can shift gears with out grinding.  Try this...it takes 2 people.  With the guard off, take 2 screwdrivers, and place the shafts of the screwdrivers (one on top of the belt about 2" toward the trans from the engine pulley and the other one lifting the bottom of the belt on the underside in about the same distance)...start the horse, while holding the screwdrivers in place, the 2nd person is to push in the clutch (while the trans is in neutral) and see where these screwdrivers need to be to funnel the slack so that the belt stops turning.  This will give you an idea where the tabs need to be.  Here are some pictures of what Walfish did for a guy at the show this last June.  You may be able to form these tabs with out the guard, but it would be better to position the tabs in the guard if possible.  This will fix your problem.  I know this is not the set up you have, but the idea is the same.  You will have to do some fabrication, but should not be that hard...the screwdriver thing will put you in the ballpark.  Hope this helps.    You will also need the right length belt that allows all this to happen...sounds like you already have a couple of choices.