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Butch

Did other tractors compete implement wise with WH?

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Butch

When I was small my dad once said if he ever had a tractor it would be a Wheelhorse.

Well he never did get a tractor.

But that is a name I never forgot and I never did ask him why he would have chosen

a Wheelhorse over all the others.

 

So when I started looking for my first tractor about 8 years ago it had to be a Wheelhorse.

 

But there were some other big names out there like Cub Cadet and John Deere. Do they

or did they ever offer the implements/attachments that Wheelhorse does? My C-175

Automatic raises and lowers that heavy moldboard plow hydraulically with a throw of

a lever. It'll do the same thing with the snow plow. Wheelhorse even has a generator

and a MacKissic chipper which I know is a workhorse chipper.

 

Toro sure ruined a good thing. I guess all the outdoor power equipment has had it's

durability reduced.

 

So did Wheelhorse ever have any competition?

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slammer302

John Deere IH and Alias Chalmers Case Bolans White and I'm sure I'm missing some all had attachments but I think wheel horse were more popular there is two guys I work with one has cub cadet and the other has a White and both are always talking about wanting attachment's but they are harder to find and a lot more expensive the cub stuff is not to hard to find but its always cost more than WH

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Jim_M

Sears tractors from the late sixties through the mid seventies also had a wide variety of attachments available.

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Butch

Maybe it's only because I only look for Wheelhorse items that I don't notice the others. I do have friends

that have had older and newer John Deere and Cub Cadet tractors. The only attachment I know of is a

snow blower for a John Deere. When I look at what you can do with the older Wheelhorses it's pretty

impressive. For example the mid-mount grader blade. I think that is the coolest attachment and I have used

it a lot. The rear lift for the clevis hitch is pretty cool. Now I was looking at the Cubs and Deeres rearends from

current models to years ago models. They just have a stationary plate to put a pin through. I didn't see

anything at all that would show lifting ability.

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wh500special

Butch,

 

It's just an exposure thing.  You probably haven't been looking at the other makes so haven't noticed that most all of them - Deere, IH, Simplicity, Case, Allis, Sears, etc. - offered basically the same lines of attachements for their tractors as did Wheel Horse.  They all had snow removal equipment, tillers, sickle bar mowers, loaders, sprayers, fertilizer spreaders, cultivators, mid blades, etc.  In some cases, they even surpassed the WH offerings with hydraulic equipment and accessories.

 

Most everybody offered some kind of rear lift system.  Most were an available accessory that attached easily and did the same job as the WH slot hitch or clevis hitch.  In fact, WH was a bit of the odd man out when you consider rear lifts since they stuck to the propritary slot hitch design and avoided the clevis/sleeve hitch for so long.  Three points were probably more widely available from other makers too.

 

Most of them offered some kind of quick attach hitch system.  Some even permitted multiple implements to be accomodated at the same time.  The market was quite competative and nobody drastically outdid the other guy for very long or with very many accessories.

 

As you look around you'll also start seeing that a lot of the attachments amoung the various brands look incredibly similar.  That's because many of the items were manufactured by outside suppliers and differed primarilly in attachment hardware.  Snowthrowers spring immediately to mind.  Haben, Roxy Bonner, Bervac, Ohio Steel, etc spring to mind as suppliers.

 

I didn't really realize the competitiveness of the industry until I started to get interested in other color tractors.  Innovations were largely shared among the makers.

 

I'm not sure I'd agree that Toro ruined a good thing.  They tried to sell what people were buying and hung on to the old tractor designs way longer than probably made sense to the ownership of the company.  Hardly any of us bought these things new in the Toro days (post 1986).

 

There's a lot of neat equipment out there.  Poke around a bit on the Simpletractors, weekendfreedommachines, or onlycubcadets sites for some neat pictures of some wild attachments.

 

Steve

Edited by wh500special
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boovuc

Hi Butch,

All the major brands have attachments like WH did. Wheelhorse had the only product line that made implements that fit a broad spectrum of tractors over a long period of time. The no name 70's tractors  to the C series to the 300, 400 and 500 series all had, (for the most part), interchangeable implements. No other manufacturer of tractors did this. Many manufacturers changed their model years frequently and each model change meant only that model year implement fit that tractor.

 

Also......don't be too hard on Toro. They could have killed the 300 & 400 series tractors when they purchased Wheelhorse but they didn't. As a matter of fact, they kept the line going for almost 2 decades including the availability of parts. They even added the 500 series to what they called the "Classic" line of Garden Tractors. I would like to think that Toro may have actually helped Wheelhorse rather than hurt it. They may have gone under in the late 80's had it not been for the Toro buyout!

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Keith

I don't think Toro was able to significantly expand the dealer network of Wheel Horse at the time when the garden tractor market was maturing.  The WH tractors are not well known here in south Texas. But I have also never seen a snow blower in south Texas.      The lower cost lawn tractors flooded the market, although often criticized on this forum these lower priced machines met a significant residential market demand, which is largely focused on cutting grass. And believe it or not, many aren't looking for a lawn tractor that might last forty years.

 

Toro sure ruined a good thing. I guess all the outdoor power equipment has had it's

durability reduced.

 

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Butch

I didn't realize there were so many other tractors that offered the attachments. Had it not been for my

dad I probably would have looked at Fords. I led the blue and there was a large Ford dealer in Watertown,

NY that always had them lined up outside.

 

You guys mentioned that Toro kept the line longer than Wheelhorse would have lasted anyway does suck.

This is where quality has taken us. I did have a pre-Toro 300 Series and it just didn't seem quite the machine

my C-85 and C-175 are. They seemed to be more rust prone. It's a shame of what has become of a great

tractor.

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Ken B

Funny, I had a guy over to my house last night purchasing a few things and we got to talking about Cub vs Wheel Horse. I used to be a Cub guy exclusively so I know my way around them. The fella I was talking with is a Cub guy. We really got into talking about the attachments of each brand and the ease of attachment of implements to each brand. He completely agreed with me that to install some implements on a Cub Cadet is a royal pain. I had my sons 854 in the garage with a snow blade on it that I was showing him. He couldn't believe the blade angled from the seat! He also liked the long sub frame and how it attached to the rear diff. Cub snow blades are quite heavy and don't angle from the seat. Its like the designers fell asleep half way thru designing their blades and didn't finish the job. I always got tired of having to get off the tractor to pull the pin and angle the blade manually. I wound up designing a way to angle the blade from the seat on a Cub myself.. I then showed him how fast that snow blade comes off. Again, he couldn't believe it. Next I showed him how fast I can install the mower deck under my 417 and have it ready to go. I really took my time on this as I know putting a deck under a Cub can be a real hassle so I had plenty of time too spare. It took me a little over a minute. He was speechless. Ease of installing attachments and how well a Wheel Horse pushes snow are the two reasons why roughly 15 yrs. ago I made the switch from Cub Cadet to Wheel Horse. To think if I didn't get that Wheel Horse that was included in a trade I made with a guy the switch might not ever have happened!

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Ken B

I figured I'd add this link to Butch's C-175 in action. This tractor used to be mine, I often wish I had kept it! I can't take credit for its restoration. I bought the tractor from Stevebo and Steve restored this tractor. Steve isn't always about the oil rub downs, he can restore a tractor just as well as anyone. Butch is right when he says this C175 was made well. Its not tinny like the 3, 4 and 5 series.

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Butch

No Ken, she ain't going anywhere! She has a good home here. She plows snow in the winter and

plows my garden in the summer. She has great power. My only complaint is the amount of fuel

she goes through. Sucks it right down.

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RMCIII

Butch - In my humble opinion, Toro is truly a quality name. I have commented on this before... There are a couple topics floating arund regarding Toro/Wheelhorse, what would happen if they brought it back, ect..... I use to work for a company called Tresca Industries. We put together Jacobson turf equipment.... 1800, 1900D, L123, 130, ect. These are all used on the golf courses. Those model numbers are from the 90's when I worked there. The only (2) names that populated the courses were Toro and Jacobson... Deere was trying to get into the market then, Ransom was also a name that would pop up every so often. Steiners were used for the "heavy" jobs on the courses.

 

I'd like to believe that the name "Wheelhorse" held a lot of value and Toro recognized that. In order to compete with the change in how GT's were packaged, I'd like to believe that Toro decided to just stop producing the line vs. trying to give the customers a Lowes or Home Cheap-O crap mower. The "xi" line was the last line of GT's produced. These went head to head with the Deere 400 line.. While they did not have the 3-point hitch, beside that the only other item they should have had, was a diff. lock. These GT's sold anywhere from $6 - $7,5000.00 brand new without any attachment. The top of the line was the 523D. There are a few individuals who own one ore several of the "xi" models. I never did own an older horse, but they will tell you, that the "xi" has become their favorite workhorse, and most of them have owned the older models...

 

Toro is truly top-notch. Don't kid yourself... In my opinion they still lead the pack when it comes to prducing the best cutting golf course units... Deere has come a long way since it decided to jump in the game, and Jacobson is still right there with Toro...

 

RC

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Keith

Butch - In my humble opinion, Toro is truly a quality name. I have commented on this before... There are a couple topics floating arund regarding Toro/Wheelhorse, what would happen if they brought it back, ect..... I use to work for a company called Tresca Industries. We put together Jacobson turf equipment.... 1800, 1900D, L123, 130, ect. These are all used on the golf courses. Those model numbers are from the 90's when I worked there. The only (2) names that populated the courses were Toro and Jacobson... Deere was trying to get into the market then, Ransom was also a name that would pop up every so often. Steiners were used for the "heavy" jobs on the courses.

 

 

 

Toro is truly top-notch. Don't kid yourself... In my opinion they still lead the pack when it comes to prducing the best cutting golf course units... Deere has come a long way since it decided to jump in the game, and Jacobson is still right there with Toro...

 

RC

 

The big box lawn tractors aren't that bad considering the price.  Many of these vertical shaft machines have decent ergonomics and more comfortable steering than the older garden tractors.  There are plastic body parts and the hydro might not be serviceable, but you can get a decade of use from them.   A 7 HP garden tractor in 1967 might have then cost $700. which would be about $5,000 in 2014.   The heavy duty garden tractor market split, the ZT entered the scene - totally revolutionized the lawn care market. Some of the former garden tractor market was oriented to estate grass cutting machines, others migrated to the compact tractors like the Kubota.   Several of the families on my street have four wheel drive compact diesel tractors. Toro is primarily a lawn care company, but better built small tractors didn't disappear from the market, but if you were to spend the Wheel Horse price today you might be looking at a compact tractor.

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