Anybody Ever Use ZDDPlus?

[tunahead72 2,337]

I'm no expert on engines or motor oils, but I've been wondering about this for a while.  So at the risk of continuing a topic that may have already been beaten to death, I thought I'd throw this out here for discussion…

 

But let's all keep in mind these words of wisdom from one of our own, member Audioshot, back in 2010:

            "Don't research too much about different oils.  Your head will explode."

 

I picked up a brochure this past October for a product called ZDDPlus.  The brochure is targeted primarily to classic car enthusiasts, but it does mention vintage tractors as well, and I've seen references to it on some vintage motorcycle forums.  It sounds like it might be an interesting product for our old Wheel Horse engines, and I'm wondering if any of you guys have ever used it.

 

According to the brochure and their website (ZDDPlus.com):

• ZDDP (zinc dialkyl dithiophosphate) was an important extreme pressure anti-wear component of automotive motor oil for over 70 years.  Starting in about the early 1990's (due primarily to mandates from the EPA designed to reduce vehicle emissions, and resulting pressure from automotive manufacturers), the ZDDP level in engine oils has been reduced to the point that very few automotive engine oils contain any ZDDP at all.

• To quote from the brochure: "Current additive technology has yet to develop an EP anti-wear agent as effective as ZDDP".

• When used as directed, ZDDPlus contains the proper amount of ZDDP to give an adequate amount of zinc and phosphorus to protect classic engines, specifically 0.18% zinc and 0.13% phosphorus.  Roughly, classic engines are defined as those designed prior to the 1990's, with flat / non-roller lifters.

• It's recommended that 4 ounces of ZDDPlus be added to your motor oil at every 4- to 5-quart oil change.  A 4-oz. bottle costs about $10, so 2 oz. would add about $5 to the cost of a typical 2-quart Wheel Horse oil change.

• There are other ways to get zinc and phosphorus into your engine:
  • Some diesel oils still have some ZDDP.  But most of the diesel oils I see on any kind of regular basis are 15W/40 viscosity, compared to the straight 30 weight that's typically recommended for Wheel Horse tractors.  Diesel oils also tend to contain more detergents than those designed for gasoline engines, and I know there are different opinions about whether our older small engines should use detergent oil at all.
  •  
  • Some racing oils also contain ZDDP.  But these are clearly designed for severe short-term duty, not the daily longer-term tasks that we typically use our Wheel Horses for.
  •  
  • There are several additives that contain some zinc and phosphorus compounds.  STP Oil Treatment (regular & high mileage) and Rislone Engine Oil Supplement with Zinc Treatment come to mind.  The MSDS sheets for these products aren't very specific about the amounts of zinc and phosphorus they contain, but they're generally pretty small.  As the ZDDPlus literature describes it, what these products mostly contain is a large quantity of "unspecified" oil.

So, I'm curious what you guys think.  I'm considering picking up a bottle of ZDDPlus and adding a couple of ounces the next time I change the oil in one of my tractors.  I might be talked into serving as a guinea pig and letting everybody know what happens.  But right now I'm interested in hearing what anybody else has to say about the product, either from personal experience or knowledge of the theory behind it.

 

By the way, I got the brochure from a pretty large and busy diesel service shop in Pennsylvania.  I found this interesting, because nowhere in the brochure or on the website have I found any recommendation that this product ever be used in diesel engines, only gas.

[Thunderlizard 1]

I've been a faithful user of STP specifically for the ZDDP it contains for years.  ZDDP is one of the best metal-to-metal wear agents, and the ad is correct -  that modern motor oils have removed much of it (mostly due to a claim that it caused premature catalytic converter failure as the zinc reacted with the metalin the cat).  Shell Rotella T (I use the T6 synthetic 5w-40) has one of the highest concentrations of ZDDP still around.  I've used it and STP in my motorcycles for years, with no wet-clutch slip but much smoother shifting. But regardless, for a slinger type oiler, I say it's indispensible. It's in my Kohler engine on my new (old) 312-8.

 

I can say this - I've been on and read numerous blogs on teh subject, and most agree that the ZDDp level in STB Blue is more than sufficient when added in teh concentration they say.  Anything beyond that and theye is no additional gain.  So that beiing the case, if the ZDDP Plus is more expensive, why not just use STP?  JMHO!

[KATO 115]

There are also synthetic options available.

 

http://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-product/motor-oil/gasoline/sae-10w-40-synthetic-premium-protection-motor-oil/

[Fordiesel69 210]

There are still quite a few modern diesels with flat lifters, and I am not reading about cam failures as much as injection related failures.  A 15w-40 is a good choice, as well as custom ordering the diesel version of shell rotella ta sae 30.  Its very hard to obtain in my area. 

[qd-16 14]

I have been using the Amsoil small engine 10w30/ sae30 oil in my single K's.  I read it is an SL rated oil that has the higher zinc/ phosphorus levels.

[buckrancher 2,675]

I use it in all my single cylinder kohlers

[tunahead72 2,337]

I use it in all my single cylinder kohlers

 

"it", meaning ZDDPlus?

[buckrancher 2,675]

yes

[tunahead72 2,337]

 

I use it in all my single cylinder kohlers

 

"it", meaning ZDDPlus?

 

 

 

yes

 

Very good to hear.  If you're going to be at the Arendtsville show again, I'll plan to stop by and chat for a minute if you don't mind.

[MarkPalmer 80]

I would like to know if there are proven advantages that this Amsoil "ZZD Plus" oil offers over a few ounces of STP Oil Treatment added to a good quality of regular 30W myself when used in a Kohler K single.  I heard all this marketing hype over Amsoil when I did big diesel work too, yet never actually saw one ounce of physical proof that this hissing pricey snake did anything to improve perfomance or longevity of an engine. 

 

-Mark-

[Coadster32 793]

Oh I feel it coming on.....fight nicely boys.

[MarkPalmer 80]

No meaning to start a fight, everyone is entitled to buy and use whatever they want in their engines.  This thread to me just reads like an infomercial advertisement for this stuff though, yet it's well known that alternative equivalents to getting the required zinc in your oil exist that cost much less than +/- $9.00 a quart. 

 

-Mark-

[tunahead72 2,337]

Likewise, I didn't mean to start any arguments by starting this thread, or to advertise for any particular product.  Just asking some questions, and looking for ideas for getting some zinc and phosphorus into my engines.

 

Speaking just for myself, it's quite possible I'll end up adding some STP or Rislone to my next oil change.  The only thing I'm concerned about is how vague their literature is about exactly how much zinc and phosphorus their products actually contain, and what else is contained in the bottle.  You'll have to pardon me because I haven't looked closely at their products in a while, but how much of this stuff do you guys typically add to, say, a 2-quart oil change in a Kohler single?

 

Thanks again, all information and opinions are appreciated here!

[MarkPalmer 80]

I use 4 ounces of STP oil treatment on the small K181, 6 ounces in the bigger 10-16 K singles.  One bottle lasts a lot of oil changes. 

 

-Mark-

[Jeff-C175 7,195]

 

custom ordering the diesel version of shell rotella ta sae 30.  Its very hard to obtain in my area.

 

My local Advance Auto stocks this.  It's not clear from any of the Shell literature exactly how much ZDDP is in it.

 

The current marketing for this is called "Rotella T1"

[KC9KAS 4,741]

From a mechanical standpoint, zinc additives are good for the engines.

 

From an environmental (waste water treatment of automotive remanufacturing) standpoint, zinc is BAD, as it is difficult to remove from the waste water.

[KATO 115]