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Why no love for the Briggs?

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Why does it seem there is no love for the Briggs and Stratton engines?

And are some hated more that others?

I understand the Kohlers are simply awesome - but my workhorse has the 16hp Briggs twin cylinder and that thing fires up every time on the first or second turn. I turn the key and it springs to life willing to go!

My K301 has gotten to the point where I've actually been asked if it runs on coal. :hide:

The Briggs – starts easy, works great, then signs off with a Bang if I don’t idle it down before turning off the key. :kbutt:

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Probably just cause Wheel Horse didn't use as many as others did. I have had both as well but do prefer the Kohler just seem to be a lot more forgiving, maybe it is just cause I am more familiar with them.

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Well, 2 things for me. I was raised on Kohler, so that is why I am probably biased to them. Second, I feel that Kohler was just a heavier duty, longer lasting motor than Briggs. Don't get me wrong, I think Briggs makes a good motor, I have had a couple of them myself, but my heart will always be with Kohler. Just my 2 cents.

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I like Kohler's a lot, but the older single cylinder B&S cast iron engines were very good too. I know the old Sears, Simplicity and many other tractors had them and they held up quite well. I wonder why Briggs stopped building and marketing them? :eusa-think:

C-85

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When someone says Kohler, the first thought that pops into my mind is Heavy Duty, and Cast Iron! Its not the same with Briggs. They are still a quality built american engine, and I've had lots of them. To me its kind of like the difference between Snap On tools, and Craftsman. Craftsman is a good tool, but if you really want best, toughest tool you can get, you buy Snap On! You have to pay more, but you know you have the best. :thumbs:

Matt :flags-texas:

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If someone doesn't like a Briggs, Imagine how they feel about Teckys!!!icon_panic.gif

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what ever engine works for you,some guys even like the teccys,id rather have a briggs than a teccy

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If you get a good BS or a tec and take care of it it will perform well and last a good while. They just don't take the abuse very well like a Kohler. Most the time the BS isn't worth rebuilding like the Kohlers either.

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They are still a quality built american engine, and I've had lots of them.

Matt :flags-texas:

I'm not so sure they're an American built motor anymore. The Briggs powered generator I bought last year has a sticker saying Made in The PRC(Peoples Republic of China) :eusa-doh: .

Mike..........

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They are still a quality built american engine, and I've had lots of them.

Matt :flags-texas:

I'm not so sure they're an American built motor anymore. The Briggs powered generator I bought last year has a sticker saying Made in The PRC(Peoples Republic of China) :eusa-doh: .

Mike..........

Just about everything is made in China now! :ranting:

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Up till two years ago, I never had a Kohler. I had go carts 25+ years ago, and was always told to get a Briggs 5 horse. Couldn't find one, so got a Tecky 5 horse. When the local track was open, they outlawed the Tecky's, said they had more torque than the Briggs. Motor was getting tired, but even with no governor, motor didn't blow. Valve keeper took a dive, but that is all I remember bout it.

My parents had an old Agway rider with a Briggs V-twin in it, thinking it was a 16 horse vertical. When they junked it, still ran great, just something with the carb. Back then didn't really know much about small engines, they didn't feel like messing with it....

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They are still a quality built american engine, and I've had lots of them.

Matt :flags-texas:

I'm not so sure they're an American built motor anymore. The Briggs powered generator I bought last year has a sticker saying Made in The PRC(Peoples Republic of China) :eusa-doh: .

Mike..........

What, Briggs is made in China now? :scared-eek: Don't get me wrong, I've bought a few china engines for some of our toys because their so cheap, and offer good bang for the buck, but Briggs isn't cheap, and I expect them to be American Made! :banghead: SHEEEESH!

Matt :flags-texas:

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I wonder why Briggs stopped building and marketing them?

There is relatively little scrap in die cast alloy motors. The aluminum is easier on the machine tools than iron. The light weight alloy finished product ships for less too. All in all the alloy motors were good for commodity deals with the major mass market OEMs where saving a few dollars is a major incentive. It would be good if B&S sold a heavy iron industrial motor but they focused on the major sellers.

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I bought a tractor in 81' with a horizontal 16hp Briggs. Ran it 25 years changing only a (plastic) starter gear, gave the tractor to my neighbor's daughter, she ran it another 5 years and just a few weeks ago got the motor back after the deck was damaged beyond repair. A little gas and some battery power -

yep - still runs - no smoke !! Proper maintenance is the key - oil changes and air filters.

I can't bad mouth Briggs from my experience with them. Hope the GT1848 I have on the to do list works just as well.

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They are still a quality built american engine, and I've had lots of them.

Matt :flags-texas:

I'm not so sure they're an American built motor anymore. The Briggs powered generator I bought last year has a sticker saying Made in The PRC(Peoples Republic of China) :eusa-doh: .

Mike..........

The guy I help with his lawncare business just bought a brandy new Skag Turf Tiger with a 35HP Briggs Vanguard on it because he dealer wanted to charge him another $1400 to special order the new Kohler 38. The Briggs is definitely made in China, says so right on the engine ID tag. Its a damn shame as far as I'm concerned. I'm not a real Briggs fan but I must say after mowing over 30 hours with it this week, It starts and runs good, is a blast to run, but to me it just doesnt seem to have the snot that our Turf Tigers with the Kohlers have in some situations. Especially when mowing uphill in heavy grass and weeds. Plus its alot louder and throws off a ton of heat when mowing. I cant wait to see how that Kohler 38 runs. Hes supposed to buy one for 2013 and get rid of our 2005 Sabretoothed Tiger.

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B&S can make very good motors. The issue is the end user usually wants the cheapest motor they can get that will survive past the warranty period. Briggs will build a cheap one if thats what the customer wants.

Kohler made things cheaper also. Look at KT 17 series one, vs the older cast iron 2 cylinders used in the D series. Even with in a line Kohler would build a cheaper version if thats what the end user wanted. KT 17 for WH had dual ball bearings on the crankshaft, Same KT 17s for John Deere used cheaper sleeve bearings.

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Wow Paul I never knew that about the KT 17

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If the EPA does not find a cause to force current small engines to be discontinued, the high volume commodity engines will offer versions with improved durability at low costs. Same basic design with some extras. That is especially true for the vertical shaft motors. The Vanguards are not so common as to be low cost.. The B&S motors are made in China in highly automated production lines. Workers assemble the motors but much of the process is automated, just as would be the case in the USA. The cost of US regulations, health care etc is as much as factor as low wages. I read that shipping by container ship from China costs less than shipping by truck from northern CA to LA. The quality is high as long as they have US engineers on site doing audits. I read a report from the 1970s that said Honda was expecting to soon pass B&S in number of units sold, but that did not happen. The profit margins on the motors must be pretty thin.

As good as the iron Kohler was, I wish they had steel connecting rods and insert bearings as did the Onan

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I know not a tractor motor but you cannot disagree that the Briggs 5hp L-Head is not like the Small Block Chevy of the small engine world.

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Briggs & Stratton like a lot of other companys made cheep low cost products that has caused there bad name with a lot of people. I had a push mower that they put an alum. key on the flywheel. After the second time or so I bought keys for it 12 at a time. It would kick back and mark the key then it wouldn't start. Not real good public relations. Black & Decker did the same way with drills and saber saws.

Both companys also made some great equipment before they made cheep products to sell at K-Marts and similar stores. Cutting quality has never been good for a product name. The lawn and garden tractor market has gone down it's hard to find a top of the line engine in any thing less than $5000. Then some at that price still don't have top of the line engines. I like Briggs & Stratton Vanguards but i will not buy anything with a Inerteck or the other names they come up with ever year or so.

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A few days ago I looked at two hew garden tractors at a Sears store. Both were powered by 26 HP motors, the model with the "professional series" Briggs was priced at twice as much. I don't know what features the P/S models have that set them apart. I think most purchasers would role the dice and get the lessor priced model. You could buy two of the cheaper model for the same cost.

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my experience's the briggs don't have the power and torque of the kohler's or the onan's . i had a c161 twin with the 16 hp briggs and my 314-8 with a kohler command had more power than that 2 twin, just my 2 cents worth. give me a kohler or onan any day not saying the briggs are bad but just not my cup of tea

eric

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A few days ago I looked at two hew garden tractors at a Sears store. Both were powered by 26 HP motors, the model with the "professional series" Briggs was priced at twice as much. I don't know what features the P/S models have that set them apart. I think most purchasers would role the dice and get the lessor priced model. You could buy two of the cheaper model for the same cost.

Which is why Kohler no longer makes the K series and from what I have read a lot of their new motors were built to a price point rather than a longevity of service point. We live in a throw away society.

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i had a deere a few years back when i had the horse torn apart ,every thing including tranny,needed to cut the lawn so i went to home depot and bought the biggest tractor they had,it had a 25 hp briggs with a cast sleeve which they called the professional series,it was a decent lawn mower and the 25 hp was hard to slow down with a 48 inch deck,but it was no k341 and im sure when a large problem arises you throw it away as stated many times allready,a throw away society,i sold it and bought 7 more wheelhorses for the same money,not every one out there is willing to do what we do in fixing,tinkering,rebuilding,and thats a good thing or there would be no horses for us

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I have been inside literally hundreds of Briggs...and I will tell you why "no love"....

But first, Don, your flywheel keys....They key is not meant to keep the flywheel in place, the tapered shaft does that. The key is simply there to align the wheel.

The reason for the easily sheered keys is to save the crank, we all have or have heard stories of hitting a stump and breaking the crank shaft. the broken crank shaft comes from trying to stop the weight of the fly wheel immediately. After your 1st key sheered, you most likely needed to lap the wheel to the crank.

If you go inside of similar model modern Kohler, Tecumseh, Onan and Briggs engine you will simply find every other engine is made stronger than the Briggs. More material, more support and stouter pieces. As for Power, nothing beats a Kohler in my book, Kohler is simply one of if not the best built engine on the market!

The briggs are widely used in Racing partly do to their availability and , believe it or not, their light weight design. It is easier to turn up a light engine . However, as we continue to make more and more horse power many small engine racers are switching or looking to heavier, better built engines as the reliability of the Briggs becomes a problem!

Briggs also suffers from a lack of quality manufacturing. I cannot tell you how many briggs engines I have taken apart and just been amazed...it is not uncommon for the intake or exhaust port to be 1/3-1/2 blocked off by casting flash!

When well maintained and not abused, the Briggs will last a long time. I will tell you this, they have the easiest to adjust carbs out there, you can get them WAYYYY wrong and the things still run! LOL Tecumsehs get a bad name mostly because of their finicky, hard to adjust carbs....no matter how well an engine is built if you have to fight it to keep it running well, you will HATE it!

The best part about a Briggs...when they do blow up they are cheap to replace! ROFL!!

Now that I have totally bashed the Briggs...In my Opinion the Opposed Twins, like your 16HP, are the best "light duty use" engine ever built.

They were inexpensive and easy to maintain. If well maintained they last and last. The naturally balanced design makes for a very smooth running engine that did not shake itself or the tractor it was bolted to apart! (FYI - The Briggs Opposed Twins are my race engine of choice!) As you noticed, they were easy starting engines and had great torque.

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