K341 needs help, i need advice...

[wheelhorsetroy 4]

i guess first off, i'll admit my mistakes.... the bolts for the "oil pan" managed to loosen up while snowblowing two years ago, the engine being covered in powder snow (sort of masked the oil leaking) and running at full throttle, making plenty of noise with the blower and exhaust etc, i didn't hear the knock till i idled back into the garage, turns out the knock will become a clatter, pull the engine apart and find the rod cap is barely hanging on with one nut, the other is in the oil pan.. visual inspection says it might be ok with only rod and piston but i didn't have the cash for any repairs at that time..you know the price of a Kohler piston and rod, plus the misc gaskets etc.....so under the bench she goes.. here comes big mistake number two, i forgot to coat the engine with oil or grease, and the cylinder walls got a little rusty, so i panicked and oiled it up. now after using a 5 horse gilson snowthblower on a foot of wet heavy snow, i miss my old horse, and it's time to get it fixed.

my guess is take everything apart for inspection (wear and rust), and go from there. and maybe loctite the oil pan bolts?

i'd like to keep the dollar figure as low as possible, but i'll never get rid of this horse, so i'd like to do it right...did i mention that i later dropped the darn thing on the garage floor, breaking a new clutch disc, which i should have just taken off when i tore it apart for the first look inside...so thats three strikes, and i'm hopin for better luck this time.

any advice or tips from someone with more experience that could be useful while doing this would be greatly appreciated.

[can whlvr 991]

first of all welcome,if i were you and you said you want it to last id get it measured at a machine shop if you dont have the needed tools,no use throwing money at it if it doesnt measure up,maybe she needs a bore and an over sized piston,and definatly get the crank checked before anything,as you said the caps were loose so damage could have happened,its worth the cost to know where to start,and if it rusted its gonna need at least a hone,if not a bore,but if you do it right she will be good for many years to come,thats where you need to start to see what to order,then you order what you need,then the machine shop will do their work when the parts are there so they can measure them

[rmaynard 14,864]

That is too valuable an engine to not do it right. As Don said above, at least take it to a machine shop and have it measured. A loose connecting rod is never good. Don't assume that if it looks good, it is good. A banging rod has to do harm.

Spend the money to fix it right. If you don't, and the connecting rod breaks the next time, you might find yourself with a big hole in the side of the block. A couple of hundered dollars for a good rebuild is a lot cheaper than buying a new engine.

[wheelhorsetroy 4]

thanks guys, the more information i give, the more my haste and ignorance will show, ya see it was only about a three year old rebuild.

i put a softball size hole in the original block, right behind the starter... mowing on a side hill...BOOM. then hunted down another block, had the machine shop work on crank and sleeve the block, put in a new piston and rod, etc... so its really my fault that the pan bolts came loose, since i'm the moron that assembled it... it was out of commission for about a year and a half while i saved the cash up.

should i use a threadlock on the bolts this time, or pay close attention to torque and keep and eye on it after i start running it? i don't believe this is a common problem, is it?

lesson learned- never, never be in such a hurry that you don't check the oil, and inspect things before using.

[rmaynard 14,864]

To the best of my recollection, the Kohler service manual does not mention thread lock when it comes to connecting rods or oil pans, but it does have a complete list of correct torque values for all critical nuts and bolts. If you follow the manual to the letter, I don't think you will have problem.

Since you are in the confessional as it were, did you torque everything to the correct values when you did the previous rebuilt? :scratchead:

[wheelhorsetroy 4]

@bob, yes, my dad helped me put it together, if the book says something, he does it....he's had his fingers in a lot of different motors, and i'll have him help again,

i was mainly looking for the advise of a guy that knows kohlers well and might have tips for someone thats only had a couple of them apart, the kind of things that the manual doesn't talk about, but experience does.. and from what i've read, there are a lot of good guys on here that have worked on a lot of kohlers. i won't ask here, but something like the balance gear debate, i never knew it was an option to leave them out.. by the way, they're in.

i never noticed that knock untill i ran it low on oil, but would that make the rod cap loosen up? i would guess no. looks like we had a defective mechanic :eek:

[bowtiebutler956 649]

Once again, welcome to the Red Square. Troy you will definitely need to have your block and crank checked by a machine shop. I cant imagine a rod coming loose with no damage to the crank, but a machinist could tell you for sure. I dont know what your financial situation is, but if your running on a tight budget like I was when I rebiult my K-301, then you might check this place out on its called This Mans One Stop Shop, or just type in K-341 rebuild kit, and I'm sure you find the place in a hurry. He is a very helpful and friendly guy, now his parts are not factory kohler parts, they are stens. The parts i recieved looked very good, and so far have worked very well, my engine runs great! The engine kit for a k-341 will cost you 119.99, and that includes piston, rod, rings, valves, gaskets, seals, points, spark plug, and rebiuld manual. Or 104.99 without valves. If you have the money, I'm sure kohler parts are better, but if you don't then this is the next best thing. If by chance you need a rod that is .020 under it will cost an additional $20. Anyway, Good Luck with your rebiuld and keep us updated on your progress. And of course

Matt

[bowtiebutler956 649]

Any more updates Troy? Thanks for the pic of your machine in introductions.

Matt :flags-texas:

[wheelhorsetroy 4]

Matt, still reading, and reading, and reading... i want to educate myself before we do this again, and this is a GREAT place to get educated. one guarantee, i'll be asking more questions soon. :bow-blue:

[can whlvr 991]

ive only totally rebuilt a few kohlers but what you say about reading as much as you can is a good idea,and have a copy of the kohler manual right there when you rebuild her

[bowtiebutler956 649]

Those are words of wisdom Troy. Its always good to study up on something before you tear into it. I'll be looking forward to your future posts.

Matt :flags-texas:

[wheelhorsetroy 4]

finished the tear-down tonight, not pretty. i found my biggest problem a while back, realizing i didn't lube up the engine after partial disassembly, you guessed it, RUST. (so the guy who couldn't afford to fix it right away will be spending more money, ironic isn't it ) the bore is not pretty, and the crank isn't either, so i guess theres no question about whether it goes to the machine shop. i'm running out of fingers to count my past mistakes on, lol. but i'll probably feel better knowing the work was done correctly when its up and running...

not wanting to open up the balance gear debate, but do have a question. they were a little sloppy on the shafts,i am assuming that can't be good. or would oil tighten them up some? they were dry when i was wiggling on them. if thats a bad sign, i'd likely leave them out. considering leaving them out even if there isn't a problem.. haven't read enough yet.

more later, i appreciate all of the input guys!

[can whlvr 991]

there should be no play in the balance gears,and no oil wont tighten them so if you dont want to fix em,leave em out

[wheelhorsetroy 4]

any tips on getting the bearing out of the block?

i don't remember much about putting it in, maybe the machine shop guy did it, but i don't think so.. more reading in store for me....

it'll never look like a showpiece, but i'd like to clean the block up a bit, so i'd like to get the bearing out.

[bowtiebutler956 649]

Troy, you should be able to clean the block just fine with the bearing still in place, I didn't remove mine as it was still in good shape. I cleaned the block with hot soapy water, then i pressure washed it after I got it back from the machine shop, I dried it with compressed air and put a little wd-40 on it to prevent rust. When I painted it I just stuffed a rag in the hole. Now if you have play in the bearing you can use a large punch or steel rod, and hit it with a hammer in a circular pattern around the bearings inside race, or if you have a press that would be easier. Then paint it up and make it beautiful.

Matt :flags-texas:

[wheelhorsetroy 4]

thanks Matt, thats kinda what i expected, we have a press, but pressing on the inner race means i buy another bearing... and its still nice..

[can whlvr 991]

they come out real easy,on the bearing plate i heated it a wee bit with a propane torch and the bearing only needed a wee tap,on the block you need a peice of plastic plumbing pipe,i forget what size and drive it out from the inside out,id take them out so they can be properly cleaned and not getting dirty when the block gets cleaned or blasted and bored

[njdpo 1]

Don't even think about thread lock / lock tite. These products turn back into a liquid once they get hot.

And they will contaminate your oil once going to a liquid state - in a hot block

[wheelhorsetroy 4]

thanks for the heads up on loctite! I didn't know that.

[tommy3horse 3]

Hello;

I have rebuilt 4 Kohler singles in the past several years, and never had one come-up with a loose cap...yet. I torque them per Kohler spec and forget about em. As far as the bearings, I have never replaced one. I think they last "forever"

Good luck!!

Tom

[krazy_horse 59]

thanks guys, the more information i give, the more my haste and ignorance will show, ya see it was only about a three year old rebuild.

i put a softball size hole in the original block, right behind the starter... mowing on a side hill...BOOM. then hunted down another block, had the machine shop work on crank and sleeve the block, put in a new piston and rod, etc... so its really my fault that the pan bolts came loose, since i'm the moron that assembled it... it was out of commission for about a year and a half while i saved th

Dont worry about your haste and ignorance showing, I show mine all the time. Good luck with your engine. krazy_horse

l

[1975wheelhorsec160 0]

i got a my c160 from my father who got it from his father and i used it for odd jobs for about a year i then restored my rototiller and decided to till a garden i was running the tiller at full throttle and all of a sudden it stopped it threw a rod through the block i spent the last 5 mos trying to find a block when i found it i paid alot for it and it went because my father rebuilt it once before and it was not done right so do it right