Sloppy Steering on the 520's? Any ideas?

[Raider12 13]

I have had a handful of these 520's and no matter the hours on them, they all have some play in the steering wheel. I have a couple with 700 hours and 1 with 129 hours and another with only 38 hours. ALL have some play that I think is to much. Some have the gear reduction and others don't. Any ideas? Are there some kind of adjustment?

Denver

[sorekiwi 761]

Have a look at the upper shaft support that is welded to the back of the dashboard Denver. Its just a sheetmetal bracket with a bush in it, and the sheetmetal gets egged out.

How I fixed mine in shown in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=70&t=24353&hilit=steering

[HorseFixer 2,012]

im gonna take a closer look at mine tonight.

nows the time.

~Duke

[mattd860 161]

I have had a handful of these 520's and no matter the hours on them, they all have some play in the steering wheel. I have a couple with 700 hours and 1 with 129 hours and another with only 38 hours. ALL have some play that I think is to much. Some have the gear reduction and others don't. Any ideas? Are there some kind of adjustment?

Denver

I have the same problem with my 520h. I can literally turn my steering wheel 5-6 inches before the front wheels start to move. It's very frustrating since I have a 200ft straight driveway and while driving, the tractor zigzags all the way unless I constantly correct it. As soon as I take my eyes off the driveway to adjust something or look at a gauge the tractor drives off the road.

My problem appears to be in the smaller steering gear (the gear that turns the 'fan' gear side to side). There is a good amount of play between the gear and the shaft that the gear connects to. Nothing else appears to be loose like the tie rods.

I'll take a video of the steering slop and explain what I want to do to correct it later today or tomorrow.

[Rollerman 290]

I have had a handful of these 520's and no matter the hours on them, they all have some play in the steering wheel. I have a couple with 700 hours and 1 with 129 hours and another with only 38 hours. ALL have some play that I think is to much. Some have the gear reduction and others don't. Any ideas? Are there some kind of adjustment?

Denver

I have the same problem with my 520h. I can literally turn my steering wheel 5-6 inches before the front wheels start to move. It's very frustrating since I have a 200ft straight driveway and while driving, the tractor zigzags all the way unless I constantly correct it. As soon as I take my eyes off the driveway to adjust something or look at a gauge the tractor drives off the road.

My problem appears to be in the smaller steering gear (the gear that turns the 'fan' gear side to side). There is a good amount of play between the gear and the shaft that the gear connects to. Nothing else appears to be loose like the tie rods.

I'll take a video of the steering slop and explain what I want to do to correct it later today or tomorrow.

Matt you should be able to adjust the slop out of the fan gear by adding/removeing shims on either side of the fan gear.

Take a peak at the end of your lower steering shaft under the tractor...you should see a cotter key.

You pull it & the two bolts holding the fan gear suport in & add remove/remove shims as needed to get the slop out.

5 to 6 inches sounds pretty sever though.....you may have worn parts in other areas too.

[mattd860 161]

Matt you should be able to adjust the slop out of the fan gear by adding/removeing shims on either side of the fan gear.

Take a peak at the end of your lower steering shaft under the tractor...you should see a cotter key.

You pull it & the two bolts holding the fan gear suport in & add remove/remove shims as needed to get the slop out.

5 to 6 inches sounds pretty sever though.....you may have worn parts in other areas too.

Thanks for the suggestion. I've already checked into that and remove the fan gear suppor block but there were NO shims. So it appears the previous owner removed them or the tractor didn't come with them. I just ordered the shims via partstree.com. Each shim is .010". I am also having a shop grind down the support block by .030" to get that fan gear closer.

Raider12 - I hope you don't mind me hi-jacking your thread. Hopefully some of the answers to my questions will help you out a bit.

[mattd860 161]

I took a video of the sloppy steering on my 520H. Take a look and tell me what you think. Raider12 - I would check the same areas on your 520H

[Raider12 13]

Stephen, thanks for the video. I had no idea that the fan gear was adjustable at all? That was a great video. Im going to look into mine this weekend. I'll keep you posted.

[squonk 38,906]

I've never even sat on a 520 but how is that little gear connected to the steering shaft? Is it a roll pin? The reason I asked is my 704 had lots of steering slop and I found an old service bulletin about fixing slop by removing the roll pin at the gear and drilling the shaft for the next size . I want a step farther. I removed the pin and took it to a hardware store and got a pin that the old pin would slide into. I drilled the shaft for that pin and double pinned it. The 704 steers better than any tractor I've ever been on now.

[HorseFixer 2,012]

Hey Yep I got the same problem ck mine out and tell me what you think.

Thanks ~Duke

aZerW02Kj9s

[mattd860 161]

Great video Duke!! Of course you have to out-do me lol.

I got the steering block milled down .035" today for a whopping $65 . Think I need to find a cheaper shop.

Once I get the spacers in the mail I'll re-install the block and see how much free-play I still have. I'm hoping this cures it by at least 90%. I don't mind less than 1/2in of free play in the steering wheel but not 4-5 inches!!!!

[HorseFixer 2,012]

Great video Duke!! Of course you have to out-do me lol.I got the steering block milled down .035" today for a whopping $65 . Think I need to find a cheaper shop.

Once I get the spacers in the mail I'll re-install the block and see how much free-play I still have. I'm hoping this cures it by at least 90%. I don't mind less than 1/2in of free play in the steering wheel but not 4-5 inches!!!!

Matt Maybe I was a Movie Director In Another Life!

OK Matt when you Speak Steering Block do you mean part # 47 which is 78-1522 Block Bearing Now if you look on top of that

part if thats the one you have, is part # 48 78-1531 Shim .01. I think thats the part your your talking about? I am going to

take that part off and I think mine will also need a bushing along with some milling. Personally here is the parts list on mine I see

that will need a refurb or replacement.

#24 109189 Bearing-Flanged

#19 78-1411 Steering Support < At minimum ck clearances where #25 Steering Shaft Inserts.

#46 78-1450 WLDMT-C Shaft < I wonder if face of gear can be milled to make it mesh tighter with #25 bottom Gear Steering Shaft.

#47 78-1522 Block Bearing < The hole #15 78-1490 Shaft goes thru needs to be checked and top face milled.

#49 78-1481 Pinion Spur < Is worth pricing!

#12 6472 Bearing Flanged < Replace.

Naturally all these shafts need to be Measured if worn Ole Duke will fire up Ole Smokey aka Mr. Lincoln Square Wave 175 Tig

Welder And Ill give it a good fixin, and then have machined back to tolerance. Lets post our Ideas Results right here on this

post It will be interesting what we both encounter along the way. I think yer dreaming about a 1/2" I only know one guy who

can dial one in that tight and he lives in New York and likes to play with thing made outta Stainless Steel.

Good Luck

~Duke

[MalMac 1,328]

I will pass on a little tip here. On one of my 520's I did mill the bearing cap just very little just enough to take slop out and in doing so I notice that by bring up the fan gear you also put the fan gear at an angle to the gear it mates to. Depending on how much you have to mill will determine how much of an angle your teeth will mesh. By milling it you will reduce the amount of surface area your teeth will mesh. By reducing the area of mesh you will increase the amount of wear. I only had to mill .020 off and that was enough to throw the fan gear at enough angle that it only mated with the pinion gear just on the edge of the teeth back toward the seat. It's kinda a catch 22 here. Your are milling to take away wear, yet can create more wear. Myself I don't see any other way of fixing them. Just wanted to give a heads up of what can happen.

[mattd860 161]

Duke -

All those part #s are correct. The steering block I was referring to is indeed #47 and the shims are #48. The Pinion Spur - #49 - costs $93.92 from www.partstree.com. The pinion sits on a square shaft (part #46). I believe the shaft and/or the square hole in the pinion spur are worn.

I had the shop mill the steering block .030 but that wasn't enough to mesh the gears together enough. It only reduced steering wheel freeplay by about 1/2". I'm having the block milled another .020". I also noticed that the hole in the steering block is worn causing the shaft (#15) to pivot side to side before it starts to rotate. I will have a brash bushing machined and pressed into that hole to reduce the diameter.

On my tactor or, there is no play between the steering shaft #25 and gear #46 so I will leave that alone. Just as you - I also noticed looseness in the flanged bearing #12 so that was ordered as well.

Malmac1 - I appreciate the info!!! Right now my goal is to get the steering tightened up for the SHORT TERM. Hopefully this gets me through winter. Eventually I will probably order a new fan gear and shaft #15 but for now I just want to see if steering can be tightened up by meshing the gears closer together.

[HorseFixer 2,012]

Hmmmm Tim thats interesting..... Thanks for the Info!

Matt I also priced them made a Picture and by the time I refreshed my screen see you did some pricing

yourself. Here are the prices I got from one of my local Toro Dealers. Well it looks like for about 440

buckaroos you can get that steering tighter than Ole ***** Hatband. ~Duke

[HorseFixer 2,012]

Okay Matt, & Malmac Tim I think I have a solution. This isn't Ole Duke's first Rodeo! I have been studdying the diagram and you can

essentialy to the same thing by milling some off the bottom of # 19 the steering support. This will have -0- effect on the angle

Tim was speaking of, nor the angle of anything that I can see. other than moving the steering shaft a bit back but so what?

This will tighten the clearence between the # 49 pinon and fan gear on # 15 I'm going out in the Garage and see what I can

see and dig in a bit further.

~Duke

[mattd860 161]

Duke - the only problem I see with milling the bottom of #19 is that it will increase the clearance between the gear on #46 and the steering gear on #26. If you mill #19 you will have to extend the shaft on part #25.

Understand?? Don't want to fix slop in one area and create slop in another.

[HorseFixer 2,012]

Duke - the only problem I see with milling the bottom of #19 is that it will increase the clearance between the gear on #46 and the steering gear on #26. If you mill #19 you will have to extend the shaft on part #25.

Understand?? Don't want to fix slop in one area and create slop in another.

Uhhhhh #26 is a collar not a gear you mean the pinion looking gear on the end of steering shaft #25 at the steering support #19. # 46 and #25 gear cannot move as they

are shafts and fixed in #19. I dont know what in the world yer looking at. Anyways that I personally dont think the steering shaft will move that much surely not

over and 1/8 or 3/16 and that dont mean Di*k on the length of steering shaft as the collar is adjustable to keep things tight and there is 3/8 slack on the top of shaft

beteen dash and steering wheel anyways. See Pics Below. Anyways I have tore it all apart and I see what I need. Time to make another movie on account of I'm a

damn MOVIE STAR.

Cheers ~Duke

[HorseFixer 2,012]

Okay here is what I found when I took the steering apart on the 520-H. Click on movie below. Time to take Matt To School and show him proper repair teqniques!

Cheers ~Duke

F8Hb_avuNkw

[farmer 1,075]

From what I can see, by tightening up the 'bushings' and making sure the gears are snug, you'll end up with more positive steering.

One little detail , (this doesn't apply to the 'fan' gear) when you reassemble find 'new' spots in the other gears to contact each other - when the steering is straight, after all, every little helps. :dunno:

[Raider12 13]

I can't speak to how "wore" your parts are of course. But my machine is a 1997 and only has 129 hours. It has the same amount of slop shown in the video. I'd be real surprised to find a lot of wore out parts. Im thinking a little machining to my block and some tlc with the rest of the steering unit and I should be good to go? I hope?

Denver

[HorseFixer 2,012]

From what I can see, by tightening up the 'bushings' and making sure the gears are snug, you'll end up with more positive steering.

One little detail , (this doesn't apply to the 'fan' gear) when you reassemble find 'new' spots in the other gears to contact each other - when the steering is straight, after all, every little helps.

Farmer Yes thats a good Smiley, Thats exactly how it used to steer! I think so too, try and shim

everything to make the only movement so it,s just on the gears. Now when I tighten everything back up (bolted together),

the spots are going to land where they land (on the teeth of the gears for example) hopefully by taking 60 to 70 thousandths

off the shaft support will allow the pinon to mesh tighter with the fan gear. That is where 65% of the steering

play was. If I can get things to say an 1" to 1 1/2" play then I can live with that. We will see what happens.

Cheers ~Duke

:thanks:

[HorseFixer 2,012]

I can't speak to how "wore" your parts are of course. But my machine is a 1997 and only has 129 hours. It has the same amount of slop shown in the video. I'd be real surprised to find a lot of wore out parts. Im thinking a little machining to my block and some tlc with the rest of the steering unit and I should be good to go? I hope?

Denver

Denver you started this post asking Ideas on how to tighten the steering up. Well you got me all envolved here and I have

PROVEN where the play is, in all these parts. Some is by wear and if you say yours has had about the same as mine from day 1.

if that is the case then they were made like chit from the factory? "YOU GUYS AND THAT BLOCK" I wasnt looking

that closely at first but malmac is right, milling that block puts the shaft and fan gear out alignment (***** it up out of level) and

that is not the correct fix. And I know why you guys are wanting to do that....... because you

have to remove the engine to get get all those parts that I have shown out and you guys dont want to do that. too

much work huh? I know cause with the engine out its a heck of a job!!! And I was Steamin a couple times. I am fortunate well not fortunate

that my engine is bucked up but that I had it out in order to do this. If you would please measure your steering and tell me how

much play you have in it? I would like to know these low hr tractors have out of the factory.

Cheers ~Duke

:party:

[Raider12 13]

Duke, that is great video on "How to" for the steering. I appraciate you taking the time to do that. One question, I understood ( or misunderstood) that the block that needed to be milled was no.47 in the photo of parts? This is the piece with the shim under it. You were sanding the bottom of no.19?

I do like the idea of using shim stock or a feeler guage to tight'n things up. And do agree that I think some of the problem is quality control at the factory level. Some of this is chit! But I think you have covered all the bases. Im hoping to get into my in a couple of weeks. I need to finish up a bigger project first. (Kitchen remodeling $$$)

Thanks again

Denver

[mr.pipes 4]

One question, I understood ( or misunderstood) that the block that needed to be milled was no.47 in the photo of parts? This is the piece with the shim under it. You were sanding the bottom of no.19?

Hi Denver, Duke ended up sanding down part #19. Matt had #47 milled down. #47 supposedly comes from the factory with 3 shims #46 I believe. The shims can be removed to take out some of the slack. Matts issue was the shims had already been removed which is why he milled it down.

Malmac1 pointed out that milling #47 will cause #15 to sit higher at one end. He said the change in the angle reduces the area of gear mesh and creates more wear in the future.