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Mith

Mystery project

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Mith

I've got my next project worked out, this one is going to be a challenge, and something I have always wanted to do.

Anyone know what it is? (Except Ian, I think I told you....)

I have 4 of these for my project, screwdriver for size ref.

Any ideas? :thumbs:

23-03-08_1503.jpg

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nylyon

Is it a hydraulic motor?

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Kelly

Hyd. motor Thats what I said for the 4X4 WH

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Rollerman

Seems like one of the tractor forums had a setup for a mini articulated FEL job useing hyd wheel motors?

Am I close Jim?

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Mith

You guys are good. Yup, its a hydraulic wheel motor.

Planning on a 4X4 articulated tractor, not too sure about size, but maybe along the lines of small car size.

I'm torn between tearing apart the C125 to donate bodywork and an engine, or building completely from scratch with a different engine.

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Stigian

Yep, you did tell me Jim :D

It sounds an interesting project :thumbs:

When are we going to see the build? :P

Oh yes, if your going to part the C125, give me a shout if you want the unused bits out the way :thumbs:

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Mith

I'm looking to buy some steel next week. I can see dropping a couple of C notes on steel with the prices being so high.

Once I have a frame worked out then I guess I'll strip down the C125 and transplant what I need (dash, engine and seat.....).

I really would like to do a proper job, I hate badly built tractors, and I'd like this one to be a pleasure to use and work on.

I'm torn between using the 12HP Kohler out of the C125, or the 10HP big block Briggs off the batwing. I guess the Kohler is the smart choice, but the Briggs has a whole load more torque.

My maths indicates I need about 30HP to run the motors at full power, so 12 should do nicely :thumbs:

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Stigian

Just a thought Jim, would this engine be any good for your needs :thumbs:

Kubota engine

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Mith

Yuh, thats what I'll be looking for down the line. Reckon I'll kick off with the Kohler to save on cost for the time being. I'll leave plenty of room at the front for a larger engine. The pumps will be belt driven, so it wont be a big deal to swap engines down the line.

I reckon once I have the main chassis done I'll probably sit down and muddle things about to figure what arrangement works best. I still haven't decided whether to put the engine in front, or at the back. Or indeed if I am going to have any permanent tools, like a crane boom or a skidding winch.

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Mith

Bought over 250lbs of steel. 5x3x0.25" box for the chassis. Its a bit bigger than I was planning, but its cheaper to buy off the shelf than order. A few odds of 0.5" plate for motor mounts, and hubs (although I'm hoping to buy some).

Anyone got any UK sources for hubs for garden tractor rims?

27-03-08_1749.jpg

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Greg B.

Jim,

For a tractor with this much "potential", might it not be wise to consider whittling more substantial hubs out of steel? If you figure out a way to connect all that oomph to the ground :thumbs: , I'm not sure our little cast iron hubs will survive. You build some pretty serious machines!

Greg B.

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Mith

Greg, I was thinking along the lines of the HD ones that come on the larger unidrives.

Its looking more likely that I will be machining my own. I havent found anywhere that sells anything even close.

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Jim_M

Jim,

Just a word of caution....Make sure your hydraulic pumps are rated for belt drive. Most hydraulic pumps are built to be direct driven and the bearings will not handle the side load created by driving them with a belt or chain.

There are a lot of pumps out there that are capable of being belt driven, and I'm sure you've already thought it out. I just didn't want to see you spend a lot of time and money and end up with a bad pump after a few hours of running time.

Jim

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TN CRAWLER

MITCH, IF YOU CONTACT A VERY CLOSE FRIEND OF MINE HE MADE A 1/25 SCALE OF A JOHN DEERE 8020. 4 WHEEL DRIVE , ARTICALATED STEER. DIESEL 3 CLY. LEMUN

NICE PERSON LOTS OF PICTURES STOO@BELLSOUTH.NET

RON, TN CRAWLER :thumbs:

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Mith

Jim, I've budgeted for support bearings for the pump. I used one on the 312 and its still working fine after a year.

Ron, is his on 'weekend freedom machines' website? I've spotted a couple on that site. Most seem to use 2 transmissions, however, I did spot Jim Land's hydraulic one.

Thanks for the heads up, I might drop him an email.

I did a little sketching to work out the stuff that is hard to do as you go along like the steering ram placement. A quick coffee and it might be time to head out into the workshop.

chassisSmall.jpg

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T-Mo

Jim Land's articulated 4 wheel drive JD is a beauty. Pretty good job, especially considering he was only about 16 when he built it. I think he has it up for sale, if he hasn't already sold it. I watched his progress on it over on wfm, real nice job he did. :thumbs:

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Greg B.

Really :imstupid: question: If you are using double acting cylinders, why are two required for articulation? Not being, even remotely, schooled in hydraulics, I'm just curious. :thumbs:

Greg B.

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Mith

Yup Terry, nice job indeed. It took him 2 or 3 years to make didnt it?

Greg, double acting rams have a different dispacement on either end. With only 1 ram you would have an unequal number of turns from straight to lock if you were turning left or right, as 1 way it would need more fluid.

Having 2 also means I can use smaller rams for the same force, to keep them tighter into the bottom of the tractor. I'll have about 12" ground clearance.

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T-Mo

Yes, it did take Jim quite a while to build his. He also had a mishap and severely cut him self on this project. :thumbs:

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Nick

Mith, It might be helpfull to allow some movement at your pivot point. I'll try to get a close up picture of a Steiner 4x4 articulated turf tractor. They use a flat bar and a ball socket to allow the tractor to articulate up at the corners. If you don't allow some movement the stiff frame will hold a tire or two up and the tractor will spin out easily.

The twist in the frame allows things like going up steps from an angle. :thumbs:

snow04.jpg

steinersteps.jpg

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Greg B.

Thanks, Jim. Makes good sense, now. I wasn't thinking about the space occupied by the piston rod and I should know better. We have the same issue with steam engines!

Greg B.

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Mith

Nick, the front axle beam is designed to pivot, like on a normal tractor, to allow for the bumps. I did look at making it pivot for both turning and bumps in the middle, but it seems much stronger to just having it pivot in direction per joint.

I like your Steiner, do you have any more pictures posted anywhere?

Greg, I would have asked the same question a few weeks ago. I've been doing alot of reading into hydraulic steering, the valves sure are spendy, and I don't want to get it wrong. I think I have spied one on ebay that will do.

Cheers guys

All this planning was getting tiring, so I headed out into the workshop this evening and cut the parts for the rear axle. How I wish I had a plasma cutter, I might go hunting for one to use next week, someone I know must have one.....:thumbs:

28-03-08_1859.jpg

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wesley

Good start mith , keep them piccys coming mate, did you find the increase in the price of steel grrrrrrrrrrr .

wes

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Nick

Mith, I didnt notice the front axle could pivot, that should solve any problems. Also it looks like you have a nice start the new project. :thumbs:

I have a few pictures on Photobucket.

You could also try Ventracs site. Its very near identicaal to the steiner and they have some nice videos. Ventrac site

Nick in Ohio

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Mith

Wes, steel has gone up in price quite alot for sure. My steel supplier took good care of me, so it wasn't too bad. I doubt I could afford it if I was buying at retail.

Nick, thanks for the pics. What kind of HP was it? It looks like the axles are mechanical drive rather than hydraulic.

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