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Sutty

C-140 8 Speed

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C-Series14

Well I am :thumbs: here! Says C-140 8-Speed, tag reads it is a 1976 B-80 8-Speed, and it has the popular bus seat on it! :WRS: I got to quit drinkin' Mt. Dew!!! Congrats on the first "decaled" C-140 I have seen! :banghead:

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Sparky

Well I am :thumbs: here! Says C-140 8-Speed, tag reads it is a 1976 B-80 8-Speed, and it has the popular bus seat on it! :wwp: I got to quit drinkin' Mt. Dew!!! Congrats on the first "decaled" C-140 I have seen! :banghead:

Mike, the tag in TT's pic is of one of his ID tags to show Sutty what he's lookin for.

I think its incredible that we in the states are seeing our first C-140!

:WRS:

Mike........

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C-Series14

Well I am :thumbs: here! Says C-140 8-Speed, tag reads it is a 1976 B-80 8-Speed, and it has the popular bus seat on it! :WRS: I got to quit drinkin' Mt. Dew!!! Congrats on the first "decaled" C-140 I have seen! :banghead:

Mike, the tag in TT's pic is of one of his ID tags to show Sutty what he's lookin for.

Mike..........

Oh...once again, I need to put the bottle of Dew down..... :wwp: I will go back to watching football..... :lol:

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Sutty

Here we are. One from the right, and one from the left. Also my tag plate in full, and one in close up to show the numbers more clearly. I did my best with the light on the camera, I hope it is adequate.

LeftSide.jpg

RightSide.jpg

WholeTagPlate.jpg

ClearNumbers.jpg

Regards

Sutty

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Sutty

Hey thanks HorseBreaker, I'll send you a PM, and perhaps you can give me a link, or similar.

Cheers

Sutty

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TT

:thumbs: :banghead: Sutty!

The only member of RedSquare with a C-140! (and the only C-140 I know of - period!)

:wwp:

Man....... I have to get a list of the Belgium-built machines. :WRS:

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C-Series14

I agree, that is the first one I have seen!!!! :thumbs:

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Sutty

lol, I'm pleased that it is of some interest. I think I'd rather have had a common model, so everyone would know what I was talking about. Just kidding, with the help you have all given me, I've at least been able to give a little back by showing you something that most seem to claim doesn't exist. :thumbs:

You've made me pleased that I have the C-140 now. Every time I used to try to look it up on the interent in the past, I would get so frustrated, now I feel kind of honoured, so I thank you for that too. . :banghead::WRS:

Cheers

Sutty

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Tony S

Hi and :thumbs: from another U.K. member.

If you look on Ebay there is a guy called Bob Lewis who breaks old Wheelhorse tractors and sell the parts, he is based near Swindon in Wiltshire.

If you search for Wheelhorse parts on Ebay you can contact him through the site, via his ads.

Regards Tony.

Ps I've just noticed Bob Lewis (Horsebreaker) has replied to this thread before me! Doh!

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Sutty

Thanks Tony, I will do just that.

Gave myself an avatar, in honour of my new found rare status. :thumbs:

Cheers

Sutty

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C-Series14

Thanks Tony, I will do just that.

Gave myself an avatar, in honour of my new found rare status. :banghead:

Cheers

Sutty

You need to take a nice clear pic for the gallery! Folks will want to see the only C-140 on Red Square!!! Plus, I want one for my picture collection of C-Series. :thumbs:

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mcwh1950

sutty thank you for the great photo of you c-140. if you would not mind my i ask what this level is for

england-1.jpg

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linen beige

Just curious whether "Horsebreaker" has seen any other C-140 models over there. We in the states may not have seen one, but, since the Belgian builts are in the U.K. this model may be kinda common there. :thumbs:

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Sutty

Sorry about the delay, but I've had a very busy day today. The item you marked is a pull switch, but now I think about it, it is not original. Sorry to disappoint, but you are very observant none the less. However it was a replacement for a 3 position toggle switch that was previously there, and I don't know what it, or the previous one did. I don't think it works now. I'd like to fix it up though if I could. There is a decal underneath, or around it, and it says in the middle, Lift, and then above it it says Up, and below it it says Down. I guess it is for electrically lifting the mower deck or something, but I just do that with the big lever/handle.

Cheers

Sutty

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popwheelie

Hello and :thumbs: I had a starter motor self destruct on my Charger 12 with 12 hp Kohler, I was told by an old time backyard mechanic to piece the magnet back together in the can and hot glue gun it back together!!!!!!!!!! Yup I thought he was nuts, but..... it worked great and that was ten years ago!!!!!! If you have no other option, it may be something to consider.

Stu

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Sutty

Hey thanks Stu, Not stupid at all, and it obviously worked. I was going to remove all the broken bits of magnet and glue it all up somehow. Pretty sure I could have got it to work too, if it had been the only problem. Unfortunately though the broken pieces of magnet, flying around inside, damaged the wiring of the armature. I was gonna try fixing that up too, but I can only find one end of the cut wire. Three inches had been cut off, and the other end is just missing. In the end I just thought, what the heck, I will get a replacement. HorseBreaker has fixed me up, and I have a used unit on its way. I should have it by the weekend and be able to get her up and running again. Once that is achieved I can start to think about the carburettor, or general the running problems that I mentioned.

Thanks to everyone who has helped, I will certainly keep you posted as to how things pan out.

Regards

Sutty

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Sarge

The switch, by your description would probably have been for an electric lift for picking up attachments.

Don't let go of that tractor, or at least send it to the States if you do.

Sarge

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Sutty

Hi Sarge, Don't worry I have no intention of letting it go, but I might if I can't get it started, lol.

Just kidding, I think it is just a matter of working my way through the obvious, but I have little to no experience of engines, so I am learning as I look, as it were.

So far this is what has happened. As you know the starter was busted up, so I now have my replacement fitted. I'm not convinced it has as much torque as my previous one, but that's another story. It is the right model, so it should have. Anyway, the engine now turns overs, just.

Next problem, there was no spark. So, since everyone keeps saying check the points, I thought I'll check the points, and guess what they looked really ropey, maybe that explains the poor running I had at the end of the season.

Anyway, I don't have new ones so I have cleaned them, and visually gapped them, because I have no feeler gauges. I will do it properly by making a feeler gauge of the right thickness, and measuring it with a micrometer that I have. Is it meant to be .02", I think at least I have found out that info. Anyway the real question is, since I am so ill informed, if I now have a really healthy looking spark from the spark plug, which I do, and it would seem the points cleaning has done the trick, is there any point in worrying about it further? The timing seems to be built into the engine, as the points are operated by a little probe, so I can't see how adjusting the gap could have much effect other that whether the plug sparks properly or not, which it does. Can I now go ahead and start it, even if I may not have exactly the right gap?

Whether I can or should have, I have been trying, and it still won't start, so now I am down to the fuel system, I think.

After an attempted start there is no fuel on top of the piston in the cylinder head. It looks dry, and the plug is not wet, which I'm sure cannot be right. I guess I now work my way backwards from the carb to the tank, and find out where it is blocked. If I have fuel at the carb, then I guess it is my carb, and I will need to take it off and inspect and clean it. I know you guys say they are simple, but are they simple enough for someone with almost no engine experience at all, like me?

It has sat for many months now without being run, so I'm not surprised I had more than one issue, but hopefully I will get there. It seems like good fun trying anyway.

I have posted this in here and not in engines, because you guys have been so helpful so far, and I thought you might like to know how I was getting on, plus I'm sure you are all good with your engines anyway.

Thanks again for your time.

Cheers

Sutty

p.s. I haven't forgotten to do some better photograghs. Two things are stopping me. First until it starts it is damned hard work pushing it in and out of my shed, and second I'd like some better weather than the miserable foggy days we've been having here lately.

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TT

.020" is only the baseline setting for the point gap and is good enough to get them running. There are provisions for using a stroboscopic timing light, but I usually just set them "by ear". You have a good strong spark at the plug and that should be sufficient for now.

The fuel system shouldn't be hard to check either. You can remove and drain/rinse the tank as the first step. Inspect the rubber hose from the tank to the fuel pump and from the fuel pump to the carburetor while you're there. If it doesn't already have an inline filter, install one between the tank and the fuel pump. You might even want to install all new rubber hose at this time.

If you look directly on the bottom of the carburetor, you'll see a "bolt". Remove the bolt and carefully (so as not to destroy the gasket) remove the float bowl from the carburetor. Dump out any residue and clean the inside of the bowl. (if there was still "good" fuel in the bowl, you should be fine. If it's all sticky and gummy, you'll probably have to remove the carburetor for proper cleaning.

If things look good, reinstall the bowl on the carburetor.

Reinstall the tank and attach the gas line, then add some fresh gas.

Before you reattach the hose at the carburetor inlet, blow air into the filler opening of the tank until the gas flows from the unhooked hose. (this should "prime" the fuel pump) You can also turn the engine over with the starter to prime the fuel system, but blowing in the tank is usually quicker.

Attach the hose to the carburetor and give it a try. Hopefully, you'll have a running engine.

:thumbs: :banghead:

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Sutty

Thanks for the quick advice and suggestions TT. I will give that a try tomorrow and I'm pleased you made some suggestions that may get me going without the need for fully stripping the carb.

I'll start with the things you suggested, which seem very sensible to me. Although sensible I probably wouldn't have thought to try them though, and would have dived in and removed the carb, rather than checking the bowl first.

It is a good job that a good spark should be sufficient to get me going, because I wouldn't have a clue about setting them "by ear", lol.

Once I have it running though, perhaps you could explain how I do that as well.

Off to bed, as it is late here now, and I want to be nice and fresh in the morning to once again take a look at it, following your very clear advice.

Thanks again.

Regards

Sutty

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TT

Hopefully you will check this topic again before you begin working on your C-140.......

If you do have to remove the carburetor bowl, you can remove the air cleaner mounting plate to make the job easier. Just be very careful when reinstalling the three screws that secure it to the carburetor -- the threads can strip easily if you over tighten the screws.

The bowls will sometimes seem like they're glued in place - caused by years of gas drying around the top edge and the tight fit at the bottom of the carburetor body.

If you have a problem removing the bowl, you can try lightly tapping on the side with a screwdriver handle, etc. The worst that could happen is that the gasket would rip and you would need to buy a new one. (there's actually an o-ring and a gasket in there)

If there is still fuel in the system, you can remove the bolt in the bottom of the carburetor and try to drain the bowl that way - without removing it.

Perhaps it will run fine without having to disturb anything else on the carburetor. :thumbs:

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rickv1957

That is neat,The C140! :thumbs: Rick

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wh1257

oevel.jpg

This wheel horse must surely be made in the factory here in belgium is the factory in geel oevel I am myself just been like all my wheel horses I have all have the same types of plate

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Sutty

Okay TT, thanks for the extra advice. I did check in this morning before I started, and I saw what you had written. It helped to remove the air filter mounting plate, so thanks for that. I can now report the results.

First things first, I removed the bowl, and it had normal petrol in it, but it also had some bits of debris in there too. Nothing too bad, but I gave it a thorough clean, and I sprayed everything with carburettor cleaner as well, and put it back together, being careful, as you suggested, not to cross thread or overtighten the air filter mounting plate screws. They were not excessively tight when I undid them, so I went for a similar degree when I tightened them up again.

I think the fuel line was original, as it had become so stiff it was almost like iron bar. This meant that the short length was extremely difficult to remove, as it was so rigid between the pump and the carburettor. Since I figured it would be cheap enough, and a sensible thing to replace anyway, I went ahead and bought some fuel line, and have now replaced the entire line from the tank to the pump and from the pump to the carburettor. I didn't have a filter in the line, and didn't get one at this stage, but will pick one up at a later date as it seems a very sensible thing to have in place, considering the risk of dirt and debris getting into the tank during filling.

Whilst I was changing the fuel line, I removed the tank, drained the fuel, and rinsed out with some more fuel, and then completely filled it. I then primed the entire line and the pump by blowing into the tank as you suggested. I had left the short line off at the carburettor, and could see fuel blowing out of the end of the pipe, so I know I had fuel at this point. I then checked the pump and when I turned it over fuel was pumping out, in spurts, from the end of the line. Lastly I reconnected this short piece of fuel line and tried again.

Once again I was disappointed in the torque provided by the starter motor, and I have a brand new fully charged battery, however, I did get it to turn over a decent number of times, but it still didn't fire, and still the top of the piston and the plug remains dry and nor does it smell of petrol either.

I guess my next step is to remove the carburettor and begin the process of stripping it down?

Thank you so much for the advice so far, and I'll wait to hear your thoughts as to what I should try next?

Incidentally, if you're wondering how I managed to keep it running for all this time, and not already know any of this, it is because I used to have a guy come round and service it. He was retired, and was doing small engine jobs like this for a little extra cash. He's now given up completely, and so I am left to find someone else, or have a go myself. Since I am quite interested to learn, I thought, at least in the first instance, I would have a go. And when I say I, of course mean we, because without your advice I wouldn't have a clue. :thumbs:

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TT

On the very top of the carburetor (almost centered) is the high-speed mixture adjustment screw. Turn it clockwise until it lightly seats and remember how far you had to turn it so you can return it to the same position. (could be around 2 to 2.5 turns )

Now you can remove the screw (attached to a long hollow pointed tube) and clean the tube. If you want to remove the bolt securing the bowl and spray some cleaner straight down through the carb, you can at this time. :thumbs:

Reinstall the main jet needle and adjust it to where it was prior to removal.

Try to start the engine again and if it doesn't pull fuel in, give it a little shot of carb cleaner in through the carb and try again.

I suspect that once you get it to run a little, it should pull fuel in on it's own.

If you get it to this point and have any more questions or problems, put up another post. :banghead:

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